Dead or Alive series formats and tools

[Protocol X27]

Currently I'm moving my stuff to C#/.NET 4.0, also there is idea to create app for tmc tinkering (e.g. disable reference to particular mesh group or set transparency flag for material). As for object rotater - I never got my hands on the original script. As far as I understand it fixes issues with TMC Praser injection functionality? Then, since there is still no max script for PC, there is no way to test it? Anyway it seems this question is more related to mariokart64n since he is the author of TMC Praser.

Nice! Have all those current releases been .NET? Or future ones. I never looked at the source, so wasn't sure.

I can find the original, and get it to you. Even though we don't have an importer, just fixing the matrix will be helpful because the vert coordinates from the 360 can be copied into the PC version. If the matrix is still messed up in the PC version, the 'correctly rotated' verts from the 360 won't line up when displayed in Noesis or in game, of course.

[Darko]

@sf234
What's your next project? If you aren't in the middle of a big one any chance you convert the object rotater that b0ny made... OR if you ran across the information with the Noesis plugin update, clarify if PC models still have the object rotation matrix issue? Ayane_DLCU_004 & COS_002 (and others) had issues in the 360 version, and the 3dsmax script was never adjusted to fix the rotation so the app fixed the matrix itself.

Currently I'm moving my stuff to C#/.NET 4.0, also there is idea to create app for tmc tinkering (e.g. disable reference to particular mesh group or set transparency flag for material). As for object rotater - I never got my hands on the original script. As far as I understand it fixes issues with TMC Praser injection functionality? Then, since there is still no max script for PC, there is no way to test it? Anyway it seems this question is more related to mariokart64n since he is the author of TMC Praser.

Do you want Mariokart64n scripts??

[Rosalin]

Do you want Mariokart64n scripts??

It seems that we already had another script translator.

[NebulaUK]

No need to be rude I know it's more difficult and I appreciate what you are saying I just figured that since 360 models can be converted to PC perhaps the knowledge that you clever guys have learned may make it easier. If you look on the 360ISO site there was loads of interest in this and they succeeded in making mods for it though they refused to share them.

Yea those people where us lol
and we refuse because people like you.

People like me huh what have I done to deserve this.

[Seyiji]

No need to be rude I know it's more difficult and I appreciate what you are saying I just figured that since 360 models can be converted to PC perhaps the knowledge that you clever guys have learned may make it easier. If you look on the 360ISO site there was loads of interest in this and they succeeded in making mods for it though they refused to share them.

Yea those people where us lol
and we refuse because people like you.

People like me huh what have I done to deserve this.

These things they take time. Just keep an eye on this thread and when the tools are done and the discoveries are made I'm sure those who are working on it will tell you. Poking you head into the front seat every day asking are we there yet isn't helping anyone.

[Lilstormcloud]

No need to be rude I know it's more difficult and I appreciate what you are saying I just figured that since 360 models can be converted to PC perhaps the knowledge that you clever guys have learned may make it easier. If you look on the 360ISO site there was loads of interest in this and they succeeded in making mods for it though they refused to share them.

Yea those people where us lol
and we refuse because people like you.

People like me huh what have I done to deserve this.

No idea what you mean,

I said "people like you"
unless you're implying you're the "people" I'm talking about, I don't see how anything you've done is connected to what I've stated.

[NebulaUK]

No idea what you mean,

I said "people like you"
unless you're implying you're the "people" I'm talking about, I don't see how anything you've done is connected to what I've stated.

I apologize then I thought you were implying something my mistake.

[SleepySea]

I decided to get my hands dirty with some practice projects. I saw a tutorial over at GVZ on how to convert 360 model vertices to PC model which caught my attention.

It seems like a great way to get started on making some basic mods since 360 tools are more complete. I have created a GUI tool aimed at converting vertices from 360 to PC TMC and have been able to get some groups of vertices to convert correctly (body mesh seems to work ok). However, it seems quite error prone since the method described in the tutorial (credit to HarryPalmer) is to use the mesh_data found in the user_Defined section in 3ds Max when a model is opened using mariocart64n's script to find information such as buffer length, number of vertices, starting address and use the first 12 byte (I think this is the x,y,z of the FVF) of information to look up the address in the PC TMC file, but some times there are multiple matches in the file.

Is there a better way to interpret groups of vertices found in the TMCs? I am very new to the hex editing thing. I have been trying to follow mariocart64n's script and the neosis's doa5pc plug in to see how its done, but I am not very familiar with either language. Guess there's no shortcut here. Time to get back to understanding the TMC file structure.

[Protocol X27]

I decided to get my hands dirty with some practice projects. I saw a tutorial over at GVZ on how to convert 360 model vertices to PC model which caught my attention.

It seems like a great way to get started on making some basic mods since 360 tools are more complete. I have created a GUI tool aimed at converting vertices from 360 to PC TMC and have been able to get some groups of vertices to convert correctly (body mesh seems to work ok). However, it seems quite error prone since the method described in the tutorial (credit to HarryPalmer) is to use the mesh_data found in the user_Defined section in 3ds Max when a model is opened using mariocart64n's script to find information such as buffer length, number of vertices, starting address and use the first 12 byte (I think this is the x,y,z of the FVF) of information to look up the address in the PC TMC file, but some times there are multiple matches in the file.

Is there a better way to interpret groups of vertices found in the TMCs? I am very new to the hex editing thing. I have been trying to follow mariocart64n's script and the neosis's doa5pc plug in to see how its done, but I am not very familiar with either language. Guess there's no shortcut here. Time to get back to understanding the TMC file structure.

The upside is that working with vertices with 360 & PC are the same in terms of grouping, but the downside is that they have different buffer lengths. The mesh data is useful for 360, but not PC. The vertices are stored in the TMCL for 360, but in the TMC for PC. Finding vertices is a matter of identifying a mesh object in 3dsmax, for example the body or a scarf. This will at least suggest which number it is in the mesh group (WGT_body) for example. Once you know that you can use the ObjGeo information to find the number of verts & indices contained in that mesh group. It's slightly more involved, but I'm just describing where to look. Once you find the info the ObjGeo, and identify which vertex group the object belongs to, you can move on to either the Vtxlay or IdxLay to find specific vertices or indices.

Vertices are grouped within the VtxLay by their lengths. For example, WGT Body (for 360) may have two groups, one for 40 and one for 44, all 40's will be grouped first and then 44's next if stated in that order in the ObjGeo. The order of the mesh objects inside the ObjGeo, though, may not necessarily be grouped in that order, as evident in the 'mesh_data' The key difference with the vertex buffers from 360 to PC is that PC has at least 2 to 5 more values. 44's from the 360 are now 64 (5 * 4 bytes), etc. We still don't know what all values do, but they seem to still have the same order with some of the new values inserted into a couple new locations. X,Y,Z coordinates are still in the same position, so if you at least know to find the correct start & end of vertex blocks, you should be able to know which values are the coordinates... the first 12 bytes, with each set of 4 being one axis.

[Lilstormcloud]

Nice work, welcome.

mesh_data = #(#(44, 44, 44, 44, 44, 44), #(176, 400, 168, 2770, 1367, 5981), #(6123536, 6131280, 6148880, 6156272, 6278152, 6338300), #(), #(), #())

#(#(44, 44, 44, 44, 44, 44): So far you should know that 44 is the length per vertex for each. there are 6, 44s for 6 objects.

#(176, 400, 168, 2770, 1367, 5981): these are the number of vertices per objects.

#(6123536, 6131280, 6148880, 6156272, 6278152, 6338300): these converted to hex will take you to the start location in the tmcl.

To get to a particular vertex in the tmcl.

Click on it in 3dmax, on the bottom right there'll be a vertex ID

Take that number 9067 and less all the number from the same multiplier (44) of objects that comes before it.
The body is object 6, all objects are 44s, #(#(44, 44, 44, 44, 44, 44)

So we will less the lengths of object 1 to 5.
9067 - (176, + 400 + 168 + 2770 + 1367) - 1
9067 - 4882 = 4185

The extra -1 is so you jump to the beginning of vertex and not tail end.

Note that if there multiplier is different, then only less the lengths for the same multiplier, e.g where there is (40, 44, 44) only less the 2 lengths for the 44s.

Now jump to 6338300 in hex for tmcl. (60B6FC)
jump by 4185 x 44 (2CF4C)

This will take you to hex address (638648) which is where the vertex is.

[SleepySea]

Thanks! A lot of useful tips and stuff to absorb. I am a complete novice with 3D modeling tool, but I plan on getting myself familiarized with the simple edits first.

It's particularly rewarding after a long session of trial and error (figuring out the buffer size for PC and the stuff that's stored in mesh_data etc), but like you guys said there's no simple A to B conversion.

My tool when applied to all groups of vertices some whacky stuff will show up like the attached picture.

In the mean time I think I am going to try some simple modifications to neck size to try and correct an otherwise perfect model for Leifang.

[mariokart64n]

ok what is this, peeps using my old 360 vertex editor script to edit 360 models then copy and paste the new float range into the pc files lol

[SkacikPL]

So it will soon be possible to load custom models into PC version?
Honestly, i'd just be glad with doing just a smooth-pass on all of the models to bump up the polycount a bit.

[Lilstormcloud]

ok what is this, peeps using my old 360 vertex editor script to edit 360 models then copy and paste the new float range into the pc files lol

yea lol,
3 years later, they're still as useful and relevant as day one. Proves how great they are.

[Protocol X27]

ok what is this, peeps using my old 360 vertex editor script to edit 360 models then copy and paste the new float range into the pc files lol

Don't suppose your interested in updating it to PC or making modifications to it? Like lsc said, both the Parser & the Injector work really well. Plus I don't think anyone else that has been into DOA modding knows either the 3dmax scripting or your scripts like you do. It would be a huge asset and time saver if those happened to get a couple of basic tweaks & conversion for PC. The rest of us have been trapped in app land with crude hex editing / modification / coding methods,

***
@SleepySea, good stuff, looks like you're getting a good start.